Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd
Neighborhood Watch
May 3, 2022, 2:06:03 PM
to Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Tribes worried about fair planned at county park
| Tribes worried about fair planned at county parkTribes in Southern California are worried that an upcoming fair will damage a park that is home to ancient sites… |
Jan 17, 2022, 10:50:33 PM
hi neighbors.
We were broken into this afternoon around 1pm (at the end of RivCoPlayground by the Park, formerly Bobbie and Steve’s). I was working up the road, and caught them on my security cameras. I’ve attached a screenshot of the couple, who came and left through the Park.
They spent some time wandering and looking around the property, hung out by my truck, checked the door to the garage, then went to the back of the house, popped a window screen, and entered. They weren’t inside long, and it doesn’t appear they took anything (house is under renovation, so not much there thankfully) They exited out the back door, which they left hanging open. I spoke to Deputy Young from the Sheriff’s dept, and gave him all the info. Case # is D220170067, in case any of y’all recognize these dummies or see them around town.
If any of you have contact info for Anthony or another park ranger, or the current camp host, please pass it along or forward this, as I’d like to let them know as well.
Be safe and keep your eyes open.
xo,Jen & Rob
Jan 18, 2022, 8:10:05 AM
Will someone be posting this on facebook community?
Sheila Zacker
Idyllwild Realty
BRE#01385817
C: 951.675.0715
O: 951.659.3425 Ext. 15
www.sheilazacker.com
Jan 18, 2022, 8:12:57 AM
Jen submitted to that FB group yesterday afternoon, but the admins have not yet posted it or responded.
Jan 18, 2022, 8:33:17 AM
to jenandjeroen,
Sorry to hear about this, Rob and Jen. How awful and frustrating!
Leeann and I will be keeping an eye out for the couple. We’ll let you
and the deputy know ASAP if we spot them. And of course we’ll jot down
their vehicle tag numbers if we can.
– Jacob
Jan 18, 2022, 8:44:42 AM
Rob-
Anthony Miller (Co Park Ranger) is subscribed to this list, so he should have seen your post. Will definitely keep an eye out up here on the busy end of Pine Crest, and put the word out about these miscreants (holding my tongue on more colorful language).
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Jan 18, 2022, 8:52:05 AM
Language as colorful as her hair, John? haha. Yes indeed.
Anthony has responded… he’s alerting his team, will check the Park’s cameras, and keep us posted.
r
Jan 18, 2022, 9:13:00 AM
to pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
It seems I have seen something about someone with colored hair recently. I’ll see if I can find it again.
I scrolled through my cam footage and did not see much on my system.
I did see that the Sheriff made a couple of late night slow passes last night- FWIW.
Jan 19, 2022, 8:34:18 PM
to pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
hi neighbors. Just wanted to give y’all a quick follow up from Anthony at the Park regarding the couple who broke into our house… see his email response below, which includes some detail on their car, etc.
I’ve passed this info along to Deputy Young as well.
I’ll certainly keep you posted if we learn any more.
r & j
Begin forwarded message:
From: “Miller, Anthony” <>
Subject: Re: trespass and break in!!
Date: January 18, 2022 at 3:02:18 PM PST
To: HUME <>
Good afternoon Rob & Jen,
No sign of them on our cameras they are tuned for after hours visitation so if they did this at 1pm my cameras would not have logged them.
Our staff recognized them from their visit yesterday and spoke with Sheriff Deputies this morning. Gave a description of their vehicle to sheriff as well. It was a white Mitsubishi EVO with significant front end damage. No photo of the car or plates unfortunately. They were classy enough to leave some garbage behind, including a receipt from the Liquor store apparently so the deputies were going to check there as well they might be able to get some footage. . .
Anthony MillerPark Ranger Supervisor RivCoParks (Riverside County Regional Park and Open-Space District)
4600 Crestmore Road, Jurupa Valley, CA 92509anmi…@rivco.org | (951)-529-5620www.RivCoParks.org #RivCoParks | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events
From: HUME <>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 8:30 AM
To: Miller, Anthony <>
Subject: Re: trespass and break in!!thank you Anthony!
On Jan 18, 2022, at 8:17 AM, Miller, Anthony <> wrote:
I will alert my team and check my cameras up front to see if it shows them and/or a vehicle they may have parked in.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 18, 2022, at 7:59 AM, HUME <> wrote:
hi Anthony,
We were broken into at 1pm yesterday afternoon (at the end of RivCoPlayground Rd, directly adjacent to the Park, formerly Bobbie and Steve’s). I was working up the road, and caught them on our security cameras. I’ve attached a screenshot of the couple, who came and left through the Park. Please alert your staff, camp host, etc, to be on the lookout, and if anyone has seen them or has any info, please contact Deputy Young, or anyone from Riv Co Sheriff’s dept…
Case # is D220170067.
Thank you
Rob & Jen
Jan 20, 2022, 7:19:25 AM
Nice to know the park has cameras too. Good info. Thanks for the update.
Kathy
Jan 20, 2022, 8:09:01 AM
Anthony,
I think that it would be quite beneficial to the neighborhood, as well as the Parks Dept., for your staff to charge day fees to any car entering the park and, if fees are charged, record the license number. Just a suggestion 🙂
________________________________
Feb 7, 2021, 5:24:09 PM
to Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, Brown, Kyla
Anthony-
Can you provide an update on accessibility and supervision status at
Idyllwild County Park?
The last two months have seen extremely high levels of use at the Park-
over the weekend of January 30-31, cars were lined up from the entrance
station all the way to Pine Crest Ave (one resident counted 32 cars on
Saturday morning). This level of use begs questions about current policy
for use in the Park.
Between the time the Stay at Home order was declared in early December,
and the lifting order on January 25, all camping was apparently closed
with the reason given of the Stay at Home order. However, during that
time, day use was very much allowed, though this was also very
confusing. The attending ranger said that the directive in early
December was that Snow Play was not allowed because the Park could not
manage the levels of use…but that Day Use was allowed (as long as
there was parking available). The attending Ranger said that this
directive had come down from Kyla. How an attending Ranger would
discriminate between the two uses is quite confusing.
The rationale for not allowing camping has been that it conflicts with
the Stay at Home order. Yet extreme levels of Day Use are not a problem?
Last spring, when COVID levels were spiking at very high levels, and a
clear Stay at Home order was in place, Idyllwild County Park continued
to allow camping. But during December-January, RivCo parks management
felt that the Stay at Home order should result in closing of camping?
This is very confusing and conflicting.
Regarding Park Supervision- it appears that Larry, the caretaker at the
Park, has left due to some kind of personal reasons. This means that
once the attending Ranger leaves the booth, there is no-one available
while camping is allowed? What’s the status of replacing him?
What is the status of the hiring for the additional Ranger position?
Higher risk fire conditions will be upon us very shortly, as will the
busier camping season- improved supervision will once again be critical.
Given the long term process of budgeting and hiring for positions like
this, one would hope this is well underway, to be adequately prepared
for the coming season. Can you update?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Feb 10, 2021, 12:04:30 PM
to Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, Brown, Kyla
Good afternoon John,
I’m happy to offer some clarification. During the Stay-At-Home order, outdoor activities continued to be encouraged by the State so day use was still permitted for hiking and outdoor activities. You are correct in the difficulty of distinguishing between snow play and normal day use visitation- they are both outdoor activities and thus permitted under the Stay-at-Home order. However, given we know the levels of visitation this mountain receives and our messaging was intended to discourage more people from coming up and adding to the anticipated congestion. We put out several messages out via social media and coordinated with local partners to get that message out.
During the Spring/Summer tiered restrictions allowed for camping activities within households. The Regional Stay-at-home order included camping restrictions specifically thru December/January until it was lifted on January 25. We are back to purple tier, allowing camping/day use/snow play and discouraging gatherings between separate households. Fire restrictions were lifted on January 8, 2021 in our area by the USFS for developed campgrounds. Given the regional stay-at-home order we felt it would be confusing to put out a message of allowing campfires while campgrounds are closed (and with the wind events forecast in the weeks following) so we kept our restrictions in place until the re-opening on January 25.
As far as Park Supervision goes, unfortunately Larry had a family emergency and needed to resign from camp hosting at this time. We are recruiting continuously and are resuming advertising for recruitment for volunteer positions. We are completing some much needed renovations on the house and have a caretaker selected they are cleared and ready to move in as soon as the repairs completed. We will have on site personnel for the Spring/Summer from that position in addition to our other recruitments are being pursued as well.
As far as hiring for the additional Ranger position, that remains ongoing, Due to the stay-at-home orders, campground closures, and low camping activity the recruited Ranger was temporarily reassigned to take care of other District Responsibilities at another site while camping sites were closed however now we are re-opened as our demand increases that is something we are planning for. Dustin and Kyla remain supportive in Spring/Summer for additional supervision as our needs increase.
| Anthony MillerPark Ranger Supervisor RivCoParks (Riverside County Regional Park and Open-Space District) 4600 Crestmore Road, Jurupa Valley, CA 92509anmi…@rivco.org | (951)-529-5620www.RivCoParks.org #RivCoParks | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events | ||
Feb 16, 2021, 5:02:56 PM
Anthony-
It appears the fire restrictions have been lifted at the Park- the red tape has been removed from BBQ’s and fireplaces.
There is a LOT of trash throughout the Park right now- especially below campsites- clearly related to the high traffic related to recent snows. Trash is a longstanding problem at the Park- are there any plans to try and clean it up?
This illegal fire ring was found today:
This was found near the creek, below Campsites 48-49. There were also several tent stakes, a tent stake bag, and a wrapper for a camp-style hammock. This may actually be on Idyllwild Pines property- I frequent this area, and this ring (and other items) are relatively recent. The small waterfall in this area (and lack of fencing) regularly attracts campers from County Park. (I dismantled this ring and removed the trash.)
Though current fire risk conditions are relatively low, any kind of illegal fire ring is always greatly concerning. As has been noted, this is only the most recent of many such fire activity that has been found in and around the Park.
Supervision, supervision, supervision. One would hope that the Park would be doing all that is possible to add the Ranger position that has been in discussion for many months now. The high risk fire season will be shortly upon us- and once again, supervision will be the issue.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
Hi Kyla and Anthony,
The core concern I have had about “County Park” for the past few years is insufficient staffing levels to ensure safety and good stewardship. It seems that there are likely a number of people in Idyllwild and Pine Cove who need work. How can we help you attract qualified “locals?”
Dawn Papaila
Feb 18, 2021, 12:08:58 PM
Thank you John and Dawn,
Clean-up is ongoing and progressing. We are still cleaning up all the branches, pine needles, and other debris from the storms in addition to the litter. Our staff and work crews are spending a lot of time raking, cleaning, and picking up litter as we continue thawing out I know we have a lot of work ahead of us. We increased dumpster service beyond normal seasonal levels given the visitation from the snow play and other visitors who are seeking outdoor recreation at this time and surely to increase as weather improves into this Spring.
I verified the spot you pointed out under campsites 48-49, it does appear to be Idyllwild Pines Camp. I am suspecting homeless activity given the strange location and the descriptions of the items left behind are pretty consistent with whats left behind in other camps we discover and clean up. There is a gentleman several neighbors have noticed along lower Pinecrest cutting across the trails and heading up the campground towards the hillside trail through that location (among others). We all need to continue keeping our eyes open as illegal fires such as the one you discovered are absolutely a shared concern. I’ve been in touch with Ranger Perez up at the Idyllwild Nature Center as well on this given he’s had the most recent clean up activity along those trails recently. Let’s keep talking and coordinating hopefully we can track them down. Unfortunately I still have not located them but we’ve cleaned up several staging areas in recent months where he is either farther along the road, is moving frequently, or is particularly well hidden. We will coordinate with RSO if we have any encounters with illegal campfires in our area.
I’m not sure if Kyla’s response to Dawn was able to be shared with the group. A Park Attendant recruitment for this park is currently ongoing as well I have copied and pasted below to share with the group if they know anyone who may be a good fit for the position.
| Anthony MillerPark Ranger Supervisor RivCoParks (Riverside County Regional Park and Open-Space District) 4600 Crestmore Road, Jurupa Valley, CA 92509anmi…@rivco.org | (951)-529-5620www.RivCoParks.org #RivCoParks | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events | ||
Feb 18, 2021, 12:11:27 PM
From Kyla Brown:
Dawn,
I appreciate your willingness to help advertise positions we have open for our Mountain Parks. Local residents are ideal for working in the mountain locations as they know the community well. Any help your group can provide in getting the word out is appreciated.
Below is the information for our current opening for Park Attendant. Please feel free to share. If we don’t receive sufficient applications by the closing date (Feb 22), the recruitment will be extended.
The Riverside County Regional Park and Open-Space District
has an opening for:
Park Attendant – PARKS (Idyllwild)
Closing day, Monday, February 22, 2021 at 11:59 P.M. (PST)
To Apply:
All applicants must apply for this position using the County’s new recruitment system. Since this recruitment is open to all candidates, they will need to go to the following website to apply.
Please review the following link Park Attendant – PARKS for full recruiting guidelines.
For questions regarding this recruitment or the online application process, please contact Amanda Campos at aca…@rivco.org.
Postings may close at any time without notice
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER/PARKS DIRECTOR
www.RivCoParks.org | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events
Apr 25, 2021, 11:05:27 AM
to pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Miller, Anthony, Brown, Kyla, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin
Anthony-
It’s been another winter with relatively low total precipitation- the San Jacinto mountains (and Idyllwild County Park) are already showing the signs of low precipitation. Fire season is already upon us, and the risks will no doubt be at least as extreme as last year.
It would be reasonable to expect that Riverside County Parks management are well aware of this, and have already begun taking steps towards mitigation of these risks on the lands that they manage. Public land use is at an all-time high- since literally ~95% of wildland fires are human-caused, management and supervision of these lands is a logical priority. Can you provide an update on the staffing levels that are currently in effect, and will be implemented as the fire season progresses (along with any other relevant fire management strategies)?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Apr 29, 2021, 5:30:37 PM
to pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, John Jacobs, Brown, Kyla, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin
Mr. Jacobs,
Our staff have been in “summer” schedule mode since early March to provide increased supervision levels with the increasing amount of guests with the season. We are still on track for filling open staff positions, including the temporary Ranger at this time. The candidate is processing at the moment and hopefully we will have a start date identified shortly.
Staff continue efforts mowing, weed whipping, and raking campgrounds and day use areas to keep weeds, brush, and accumulated leaf/needle debris down. Guests are advised of regulations at check in and patrolled throughout the day and into the nights on the weekends.
Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
From: John Jacobs <>
Sent: Sunday, April 25, 2021 11:05:18 AM
To:pc-rcpr-neighbo…@googlegroups.com <pc-rcpr-neighbo…@googlegroups.com>; Miller, Anthony <AnMi…@RIVCO.ORG>
Cc: Brown, Kyla <kyla…@RIVCO.ORG>; Whitaker, Dayna <dwhi…@RIVCO.ORG>; McLain, Dustin <DMc…@RIVCO.ORG>
Jul 16, 2021, 9:05:19 AM
to Miller, Anthony, pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Brown, Kyla, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin
Anthony-
Can you provide an update of the supervision status at Idyllwild Park? Was the temporary Ranger position ever filled? What is the status of a campground host?
Also- what is the status of fire restrictions at the Park?
Both the 2013 Mountain Fire and the 2018 Cranston Fire occurred in July, and it has been an unusually warm summer thus far. Attentive supervision at this time is of particular priority.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
Jul 20, 2021, 1:24:26 PM
to pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Brown, Kyla, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin
John,
The temporary Ranger position was filled effective 5-11-21 and the Park Attendant position was filled 6-16-21. We also moved in a caretaker into the residence last month. Camp host recruitment is currently ongoing, I have a candidate processing but none currently in the park.
Fire restrictions were implemented at Idyllwild Park on June 23, 2021 in line with the USFS restricting campfires within unhosted campgrounds. At that time all fire pits and BBQs were taped up.
Currently we allow propane BBQs and equipment, including propane fire rings, provided they have an on/off switch. This is in line with current USFS restrictions for developed campgrounds/picnic areas as seen here. We continue to be in conversation with other developed campgrounds in the area in efforts to be aligned with other developed campgrounds.
| Anthony MillerPark Ranger Supervisor RivCoParks (Riverside County Regional Park and Open-Space District) 4600 Crestmore Road, Jurupa Valley, CA 92509anmi…@rivco.org | (951)-529-5620www.RivCoParks.org #RivCoParks | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events | ||
Jul 22, 2021, 9:05:10 AM
to pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Miller, Anthony, Brown, Kyla, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin
Anthony-
Thank you for the update. Given the inability to have consistent supervision present at the Park (via a full time campground host), implementing the fire ban seems quite appropriate, and is appreciated by residents in the area.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
—————————————–
Jul 14, 2021, 8:19:22 PM
Hi neighbors,
This is so odd that it is difficult to describe but I think it is worth sharing.
Over the past few weeks, I’ve been awakened on at least 4 occasions by someone waving an extremely bright flashlight through our front and side yard (the side that is mostly an open lot). The light is intensely bright, narrow and it is hand-held.
This happened again last night at about 12:45 am. As soon as Paco began to bark the light turned off abruptly and I couldn’t hear anyone – no one seemed to be walking. About 10 minutes later our motion lights on our garage went on but that could be caused by an animal. As much as I tried, I couldn’t hear or see anyone or anything.
What was different about last night, was that the light was being pointed at the open lot between L and J’s property across the street and R and J’s house next door (the two houses that used to be owned by Jackie).
It just seems a bit off especially since it is so late at night. I don’t hear a dog wandering around and the person is so quiet after they shut the light off that I’m really wondering what the heck is going on. And it seems like of obvious that a light that bright might wake people and dogs up. It isn’t very subtle.
Now, if it is a neighbor who is walking their dog off-leash and using the flashlight to keep an eye on it, please let me know. Otherwise, just be aware.
Thank you,
D Papaila (Riverside County Park Rd)
Jul 14, 2021, 9:41:18 PM
We’ll get batteries and put our game cam out it on that lot. Creepy
Jul 14, 2021, 10:20:29 PM
Good idea!
Reverence for all Life
Jul 16, 2021, 5:04:42 AM
to pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Nothing odd but bugs and bats on my cams but they are set very tight on the trigger/alert areas.
I should look into freeing them up a bit.
Have they been usually around midnight or a wider range of random times?
Jul 16, 2021, 7:58:18 AM
HI B-,
All have been in the middle of the night. Some people are night owls and I guess it could be someone out for a walk. But it just seems a little off.
Dawn
Aug 25, 2020, 11:17:02 AMto PC-RCPR Neighborhood Watch Info
Tell the IFPD Board of Commissioners not to adopt a new local ordinance require fire sprinkler instillation in residential remodels or outbuilding construction. They are meeting today at 3pm to decide the matter. Details can be found on page 16 of the IFPD Board agenda found here: https://idyllwildfire.com/board-meeting-agenda.html
Here is the issue:
The Idyllwild Fire Protection District (IFPD) has had an unwritten rule in place for several years whereby they seek to exceed state requirements and have automatic fire suppression sprinkler systems installed in new space added to an existing structure and within the existing structure itself, regardless of age of the house, whenever more than 50% in area is added to an existing residence. This standard is not required in Pine Cove, Mountain Center, Big Bear, Lake Arrowhead, Lake Tahoe or anywhere else in the State, for that matter, regardless of proximity to a wildland-urban interface. (Note: the proposed local ordinance would set 30% of new space, livable or not, such as garages, etc., as the trigger for installing sprinkler systems).
The IFPD says they must take this aggressive position since Idyllwild is in an area of high wildfire threat. The logic is strange since fire suppression sprinklers on the inside of houses would not help protect the structure in the event of a wildfire.
For my project where 1,000 square feet of space is to be added to a 680 square foot residence, it would cost me ~$25,000 now and about $1,000 in perpetuity due to increased water bills and certification inspections–then there is the risk of the system failing and flooding your house (with antifreeze)!
Voice your position on the matter by attending today’s board meeting through Zoom (you will have to download the program first the enter the meeting ID: 307-288-7739; Password: 328844) and by emailing the IFPD Board (rcho…@gmail.com; hen…@idyllwildfire.com; rho…@idyllwildfire.com; dmes…@msn.com), IFPD Fire Chief Mark LaMont (markl…@idyllwildfire.com) and the Town Crier (ha…@towncrier.com; mel…@towncrier.com; je…@towncrier.com)
Aug 25, 2020, 11:32:56 AMto Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Hal-
Thank you for this. This is a very important issue to any resident of Idyllwild who wishes to utilize their property in a safe, reasonable manner.
It’s a shame that the policy implementation process utilized by IFPD has been erratic and without much period for public commentary (not to mention being significantly out of step with County ordinances, or adjacent Fire Protection Districts). The addition of this important vote to today’s meeting agenda seems to have been very last minute, and won’t allow for adequate consideration by the local public.
Neighbors, if at all possible, please try to attend this meeting at the Idyllwild Fire Dept office (or attend by Zoom). At the very least, it would be an important achievement to have the Board postpone the vote until adequate review time can be provided to local residents.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Aug 25, 2020, 12:21:47 PMto PC-RCPR Neighborhood Watch Info
Petition to Postpone Vote on IFPD appendix 513-01 is attached. I encourage you to consider signing.
Aug 25, 2020, 12:29:46 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
I will have a physical copy of this petition available to sign today- I’ll try to drop by the homes of as many as reasonably possible- otherwise, feel free to drop by my house. If you prefer to sign electronically, simply reply back to this email saying ‘please add my name to this petition’.
Remember: the meeting is today, at 3 pm…gotta get on this immediately!
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Aug 25, 2020, 12:48:18 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Pleas add Price and Dianne Diehl’s name
Sent from my iPhone
Aug 25, 2020, 1:58:52 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Please add Eric Bean and Ashley Bean
Aug 25, 2020, 2:05:36 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Please sign Ezekiel Vargas and Genevieve Alvarado.
Aug 25, 2020, 4:35:58 PMto PC-RCPR Neighborhood Watch Info
Thank you everyone who supported the petition to postpone the vote on the proposed IFPD fire sprinkler requirement. We were successful in getting the issue tabled until the next Board meeting which will take place at 3 PM Tuesday September 29th. The Board decided that it would be prudent to collect more information and public input before making a decision. They have also asked for help in gathering evidence in making their decision and I will be working with local architects and others to do so over the next week or so. I will follow up with more information soon.
Aug 25, 2020, 5:06:05 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Yay!
Reverence for all Life
Aug 27, 2020, 9:14:11 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
John please add my name Laura Swanson Elliot to the petition I am on upper Pinecrest next to the doctors office across from Idyllwild heating I cannot afford to put sprinkler systems throughout a 5000 square-foot building I don’t think this is legal to try to force through either for everybody and Idyllwild have to do it to their own homes Thank you Laura
Sent from my iPhone
Aug 28, 2020, 9:11:19 AMto PC-RCPR Neighborhood Watch Info
Hi Laura, the proposed ordinance wouldn’t require instillation of fire sprinklers in your house unless you add more than 30% of new space to your house. If your house is 5,000 square feet, then you should not be affected unless you add over 1,500 square feet.
The houses with small square footage are the ones more likely to be affected if the owners are thinking to add on later. For example, if you have a 680 square foot house (like mine) and add just 205 square feet to it (about the size of an average single car garage), you would have to add sprinklers throughout the existing structure.
In any case, the vote has already been postponed until September 22nd. The important thing now is that Idyllwild citizens call or email Fire Chief Mark LaMont to let him know how you feel about the proposed ordinance (support it or don’t support it).
Aug 28, 2020, 9:37:23 AMto PC-RCPR Neighborhood Watch Info
After responding to Laura’s email, I thought that it might be helpful to share the Letter to the Editor that I submitted to the Town Crier yesterday. Hopefully it will get published next week and spur further conversation across Idyllwild, but it would also be great if everyone on this thread could share it across their networks and encourage people to contact the IFPD with their opinion. The letter reads:
The Idyllwild Fire Protection District (IFPD) is Idyllwild’s own local government organization. It has the authority to adopt ordinances and requirements stricter than those required by the state or county. They are currently proposing what very well could become the most stringent local ordinance of its kind in the State of California. Proposed Appendix 513-01, Residential Automatic Fire Sprinkler System(s), can be found on page 16 of the August agenda for the IFPD Board of Commissioners (BOC) meeting (https://idyllwildfire.com/board-meeting-agenda.html). I encourage all Idyllwild residents to read the proposed ordinance right away before it comes up for a vote in the September 22nd BOC meeting. If adopted, it will have substantial impacts on individuals and businesses in our community for the foreseeable future. One example of a potential impact is that if you, as an owner of a 700 square foot house, decide to add a small bedroom and bathroom, or an attached single car garage, where either is greater than 210 square feet, you will have to install or retrofit an antifreeze filled sprinkler system throughout your entire existing residence. The initial costs would be tens of thousands of dollars and over a thousand dollars each year thereafter in higher water bills and certification inspections—not to mention the constant risk of a system failure flooding your house with antifreeze. Such an ordinance could also reduce code compliance, lead to less construction projects thereby negatively impacting our local contractors, or dissuade potential home buyers or businesses from investing in our community.If you don’t agree that such an ordinance should be adopted, email or call IFPD Fire Chief Mark LaMont and/or members of the IFPD BOC right away and let them know your opinion. Their contact information can be found on the IFPD website. If you do agree with the adoption of the ordinance believing it will make our community more fire resistant, do the same. Exercise your democratic right of free speech. Participate in guiding your local government institution to be responsive to the community it exists to serve. Respond to this thread in the Town Crier and let others follow the public conversation. Whatever you do, don’t remain silent—unless, of course, you want the ordinance to be adopted.
Dec 2, 2020, 12:29:50 PMto Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Neighbors-
I received the email below from Jim Marsh, one of the longstanding architects in the Idyllwild area- Idyllwild Fire Protection District is continuing with their efforts towards fire sprinkler requirements on any new additions in this District. Jim’s email suggest better language for this regulation that could help reduce confusion or aggravations, and having more of a community voice on this matter would be beneficial. If this is of interest to you, you can reach Jim at the contact information in his email below.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
****
Dear fellow Idyllwilders,
I hope you are doing well in these weird times.
As some of you know, the IFPD is writing a new ordinance regarding fire sprinklers in additions to existing homes that don’t already have fire sprinklers. It is proposing to require sprinklers in additions that are 33% (or 50%) of the size of the existing house. At 50%, this means an existing 2401 sq ft house could add on 1200 square feet without needing sprinklers, while an existing 700 sq ft cabin would require fire sprinklers for a 350 sq ft addition (not even big enough for a very modest master suite). This seems to unfairly penalize someone with a small cabin. I think there are better ways to write this new ordinance.
Would you please review the attachment for some alternatives to the IFPD wording? If you agree with me, would you allow me to use your name as a supporter of alternative wording?
I appreciate your time.
Thank you!
Jim Marsh Architect
jq…@
P.S. I am reaching out to you because the IFPD was concerned I was acting on my own without support from the community. I think they will listen if we can show that there is widespread support.
Dec 2, 2020, 1:38:10 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Yes, please use my name, Sheila Kloss, *** Pine Crest
Sep 4, 2020, 2:59:49 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
The Anza Borrego State Park has instituted a temporary fire ban in their campgrounds. Seems wise. Does anyone know if the campgrounds up here are doing this too? Maybe Anthony can comment as to why they would remain allowed if no ban is in place.
image0.jpeg
Sep 4, 2020, 3:33:22 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Saw one in fire pit 1 1/2 weeks ago. When we had some wind. I asked them nicely to please put out their fire. It was 93 degrees out around 4 o’clock they had it going to chase bugs away. I have tried many times in the past to address this with Riverside Fire as they are the ones responsible. They just say well it’s legal. Our Idy Fire has tried also In the past with no results. Just a FYI.
Sent from my iPhoneSheila Zacker Idyllwild RealtyBRE#01385817C: 951.675.0715www.sheilazacker.com
Sep 4, 2020, 4:58:39 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Currently fires are permitted this weekend in developed campgrounds up here (including State Park) and I’m sure in other private developed campgrounds as well ( I have not yet called them but most of the time they are among last to suspend fires.)
We are preparing for the Santa Ana wind event for Tuesday/Wednesday and suspending campfires effective Monday 9-7-2020 in anticipation of Santa Ana winds after this heat event hits us this weekend. For the duration I am not yet sure, it comes down to whether or not other developed campgrounds shut down as well, continued forecast of high winds/Santa Ana wind events, and other outlooks when it comes to weather.
I have instructed staff to advise guests of high fire danger (Keep fires LOW , attended, and dead-out extinguished when finished) and there are Ranger Patrols through the weekend late into each evening to monitor and patrol in the campground.
If you are walking through the campground our new camp hosts are thrilled to join the team and get to know the community they are happy to help if anyone observes issues when staff are not present.
Thank you,
Sep 4, 2020, 6:41:23 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Thank you, Anthony. I’m glad you have a plan in the event of high winds.
Dawn Papaila
Sep 5, 2020, 9:22:53 AMto Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Anthony-
The NWS issued a Red Flag warning for this weekend a few days ago- it is currently in effect:
Besides very high temperatures, the forecast for this weekend includes gusting winds up to 25 mph. These are prime conditions for wildfire, and the well documented fact is that literally 95% of such wildfires are related to human activities.
It is beyond me as to why anyone would choose to have a campfire in these kinds of conditions, but no doubt the Park will be full of such campers this weekend. It would be much more confidence inspiring to see Riv Co Parks (and the leadership of Idyllwild County Park, in particular) make decisions on campfires that were more in tune with local conditions, especially in areas where large numbers of homes border these parks.
_________________________________
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888.522.9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 5, 2020, 9:44:45 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
another incorrect statement by county parks, Thousands Trails has not allowed wood burning fires for sometime now hard to sit here and read all the false information given by this department. They have more excuses then answers.
—————————————–
Sep 5, 2020, 10:37:50 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Just to update everyone. . .as of this evening all campers at Idyllwild Regional Park have been notified of fire restrictions effective immediately and all wood burning/charcoal fires have been extinguished. We continued communicating with our partners as the weekend progressed and decided to push our implementation of fire restrictions forward a couple days.
Please notify park staff or hosts and IFPD if you see/smell campfires so we can address them swiftly. Thank you,
Sep 6, 2020, 9:17:58 AMto Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Anthony-
That is good to hear. Communicating this restriction to the masses of Labor Day weekend campers who feel their camping experience won’t be complete without a campfire (despite temperatures close to 100 degrees) is not an enviable task. But it is good to know that the leadership of this Park is able to look at current conditions and take appropriate action in a timely manner.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 6, 2020, 10:43:23 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Thank you so much. So appreciated.
Dawn Papaila
Sep 6, 2020, 2:48:51 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Hi John
I just had a couple who came into my Real Estate office at 2:30 today Sunday 9/6/20 I asked if they are having fires at the County Park. YES!! They said no one told us any different and there are no signs. The lady at the desk said nothing. I asked them nicely please do not have a fire going. I thought that was communicated to All the folks Staying at the camp sites.Thanks for looking into this
Sep 6, 2020, 3:03:04 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Signs were posted first thing this morning and staff have continuously patrolled since this morning. I made announcements site by site and over loudspeaker last night and am continuing to patrol for those who come to the parks with their eyes and ears closed.
Sent from my iPhone
Sep 7, 2020, 5:59:17 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
This was just on news..All mountains throughout California are closed effective 5 pm today…No campers, No Day Use until further notice…San Bernardino National Forest was on.list
Sep 7, 2020, 7:28:20 PMto Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
This closure includes San Bernardino National Forest, and San Jacinto State Park:
https://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/sbnf/news-events/?cid=FSEPRD799192
https://www.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=636
Sounds like a good call. Anthony, what’s the status of Idyllwild County Park?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 7, 2020, 10:07:03 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
There are a handful of campers in there tonight. There are a few signs saying no fires but none at the kiosk that stood out to me. There are fire pits that have wood stacked around them. I don’t understand why that wood wasn’t gathered.
Dawn
Sep 8, 2020, 4:09:09 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Anthony-
As of a few minutes ago, the park is very much open- there are about 9-10 occupied campsites. Given the closure of the National Forest and State Park, what is the County’s plan for this Park?
Your recent text to Bobbi stated that ‘no wood or charcoal fires are permitted’. There is a group using a charcoal BBQ in one of those occupied campsites right now.
And there is no-one attending the entry kiosk.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 8, 2020, 4:27:23 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
I just called the Fire Dept. They will do a run later and I will follow up with Washington’s office tomorrow. Sorry, there are no excuses on this one. Sheila Zacker
Idyllwild Realty
BRE#01385817
C: 951.675.0715
O: 951.659.3425 Ext. 15
www.sheilazacker.com
Sep 8, 2020, 6:13:06 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
This is the site that had a burning charcoal BBQ around 4 pm today.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 9, 2020, 5:16:32 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Anthony-
With another weekend quickly upcoming, your comments on the status of camping in the Park would be appreciated.
10 more California National Forests closed today- this means all 18 NF’s in the state are closed due to wildfire risk.
https://www.redding.com/story/news/2020/09/08/california-wildfires-close-lassen-national-forests-air-quality/5749990002/
San Jacinto State Park is only allowing camping by those who held a reservation *prior* to Monday’s closure announcement. They are not allowing any walk-in camping at all (this is apparently the policy in at least all Inland Empire State Park facilities). No campfires are allowed- only propane stoves.
A pass through of the Park this afternoon showed a similar number of campers as yesterday- no-one at the kiosk. There was a group at the far end of the campground with an open flame ‘tiki torch’ style burner on their picnic table.
RivCo Parks typically looks to the National Forest and State Park for cues as to how to manage fire and camping use…where is RivCo Parks at this particularly high risk time?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 10, 2020, 3:37:08 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin
John,
We are open but fire restrictions are in effect (no wood/charcoal fires) Our staff is working in the park morning and myself into very late evening each day over the weekend for supervision and camp hosts are keeping their eyes and ears open as they live on site after staff go home.
What the State Park is doing sounds quite wise, we are still limiting capacity at this time due to COVID and are essentially sold out, with exception to cases where people show up with no other place to go (and who are understanding of fire restriction). Generally I have had 2-3 per weekend and I do not plan to exceed that pattern with the additional fire danger especially if we experience an increase in demand.
I spoke with site 33 with the charcoal grill and turns out he’d been spoken to by our hosts momentarily after being reported and I asked him to put it away entirely.
The site in the back with the candle was burning citronella candle for insect repellent and had all their propane equipment as well as a fire extinguisher staged, they were quite prepared overall and I felt they were behaving.
I really appreciated talking with you today thank you for stopping by and I will pass along your sentiments (and forward message) to my superiors.
Sep 10, 2020, 4:16:22 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Miller, Anthony, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin, jcomerchero@rivco.org
Anthony-
It is quite bewildering that during this time of the highest fire activity in the state of California…at a time when all 18 National Forests (which obviously includes the San Jacinto Ranger District of the SBNF) have closed to any kind of activity (camping, hiking, climbing, boating, etc.)…and the California State Park system has severely limited access…
…that Riverside County Parks is essentially continuing operations with only typical fire restrictions, and allowing complete access with only slight modification. You have stated in the past that RivCo Parks looks to other land managers as guidance towards Park policies. At this time, the two largest recreational land managers in the state have recognized the extreme risks, and have acted accordingly. RivCo Parks is only following those policies in the vaguest sense, in this case.
At the same time, supervision in the Park will continue to occur at a similar, problematic low level, with self-check in- any such COVID restrictions on campsites would be dependent on Park personnel monitoring these sites. And to complicate matters, as long as the State Park campground is severely limited, and all of the National Forest campgrounds are closed, people will likely be pouring towards County Park as an alternative.
While this certainly has great revenue potential for the Park (perhaps that’s the intent here), it will likely result in high concentrations of campers at a time when no other land manager would take the same direction.
As much as your diligence is appreciated in dealing with issues like this, the manner in which RivCo Parks has responded to these extreme fire risks, and the policies implemented earlier this year as COVID-19 swept the County and State, only seem to demonstrate clearly that RIvCo Parks prioritizes revenue potentials of their Parks far above public safety and property protection.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 14, 2020, 9:59:24 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Miller, Anthony, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin, jcomerchero@rivco.org
Anthony-
In our conversation last Thursday, you stated that in spite of the closure of all 18 National Forests in the state to any kind of activities, and the fact the State Park has closed access to hiking and limited camping only to those who had registered sites prior to the announcement of the closure (Monday, September 7), that Idyllwild County Park would remain open to camping. You stated that there would be no restrictions on site availability (such as the State Park’s policy), except that campsites would be limited to ensure appropriate COVID spacing, and that fire restrictions would allow propane stoves only (no BBQ’s or wood fires).
A visit to the campground at 7:10 pm last Saturday, September 12 found the disturbing reality: the campground was nearly completely full, with large numbers of campers closely spaced together, and only a very few number of unoccupied spaces. Equally disturbing, two open fires were observed (campsites 58 & 83). The entry kiosk was dark and unattended- there were no RivCo Park employees observed anywhere in the Park.
Anthony, what level of reality is necessary for RivCo Park leadership to see that there policies and leadership are misdirected? There are historic levels of fire activity throughout the state at this time, and your land manager peers are responding to this quite dramatically- yet RivCo Parks goes on with little change (in fact, likely taking economic advantage of being the only state or county camping option). Idyllwild has had two major fires since 2013 that have evacuated the entire town– the risk is beyond obvious to all- what does it take for RivCo Parks to acknowledge and act on this?
Your professionalism in tone has been appreciated, but the content of your communication is effectively stonewalling and status quo. Given what transpired over the weekend vs. what you communicated to me in person, your integrity as a leader is sorely in question.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 14, 2020, 10:14:12 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Did you alert Idyllwild Fire about campfires in park? If so, what was their response?
Sep 14, 2020, 10:34:21 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Wow. Two open fires. That’s likely because it got cold. The fact is the County Park is not adequately staffed.
If we don’t hear any response from Anthony on this by this evening, I will share this on FB.
Dawn Papaila
Sep 14, 2020, 10:51:38 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
We went through the park Friday evening after dark and saw what looked like two open fires. We noted the campsite numbers and spoke with Anthony, who was manning the booth, on our way out. He was aware of both fires and had already spoken with the occupants. Both instances turned out to be propane fire pits. They both looked very realistic so we weren’t sure. Hopefully that’s what was seen Saturday as well but of course that may be wishful thinking.
Stacy
Sep 14, 2020, 11:44:42 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Miller, Anthony, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin, jcomerchero@rivco.orgH
All,I spoke with Washington’s sec. She was shocked and is looking into the matter and will get back to me.
Sep 14, 2020, 12:45:34 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, sheila, Miller, Anthony, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin, jcomerchero@rivco.org
No, I did not report this to Idyllwild Fire Dept.- I did, however, immediately notify Larry, the campground host in his trailer. Reporting to IFPD should definitely be part of the response to such events, though.
As has been observed for many years (and during the recent heat event), campers will have fires no matter what the conditions are like. The bigger issue here is that Park supervision has been lacking for many years now- I’m honestly less concerned about the two fire sources I observed (even if they were truly open fires), than the fact that during a time when fire risk is high, and the campground is completely full on a busy Saturday night, there is no observable supervision in this Park. As grateful as we should be for Larry as the new Campground Host, he is not a formal Park employee, and it is unrealistic to expect him to constantly monitor 80+ campsites on a busy Saturday night, when high supervision should be priority for RivCo Parks.
I am equally disturbed by the complete disconnect between what was told to me (in person, by Anthony) regarding how campground capacity would be managed over the weekend, and what actually transpired. There is a clear pattern of behavior on the part of RivCo Parks to remain open, regardless of conditions, whether it be a pandemic or extreme fire risk. This is ‘leadership’ that is clearly based on a set of priorities that just doesn’t make any good sense.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 14, 2020, 1:16:08 PMto John Jacobs, pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, Miller, Anthony, Whitaker, Dayna, McLain, Dustin, jcomerchero@rivco.org
I did and they have been going every evening. The bummer is that is Riverside county
Sent from my iPhoneSheila Zacker Idyllwild
Sep 14, 2020, 2:40:15 PMto Neighborhood Watch, Anthony Miller, Dustin McClain, dwhitaker@rivco.org, jcomerchero@rivco.org
My observation was on Saturday evening, and from a vehicle (not wanting to intrude or confront the site inhabitant). A walk around this afternoon clarified that the sites were actually 59 & 88, and there was no sign of recent wood fire activity in the fire rings of those sites. (Campground host Larry made a laborious and appreciated effort at cleaning all of the fire rings last week before this busy weekend, so it is easy to observe recent use.)
However, today’s walk around did find sign of recent wood fire activity in sites 38 & 73 (respectively, in these pictures):
(Since all of these fire rings were cleaned last week, this is clearly recent activity.)
It should not be necessary for any resident, community member, or the Idyllwild Fire Dept. to monitor Park activities, especially during high risk conditions- this is the primary responsibility of RivCo Parks. Above all, the issue here is one of inadequate Park supervision.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 15, 2020, 1:51:35 PMto Neighborhood Watch, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, jcomerchero@rivco.org
Effective yesterday, we have suspended further the use of propane fire rings for recreational purposes (It may be used for cooking then it must be shut down). That should limit some confusion going forward. It is posted on our website clearly and another round of notifications to all reserved campers went out yesterday and today.
During my patrols over the weekend I spoke with 7 propane fire rings to verify they were propane throughout the campground, and did not see or smell campfires in either site 73 or 38 both sites were dark. I patrolled approximately hourly after closing up the booth between report writing and restroom cleaning for the evening as most were settled into their sites until 1030pm. We still have approximately 20 sites held/blocked to limit our capacity.
I have taken additional steps to make the fire rings less inviting by removing the debris you reported and red-taped the fire rings to further indicate they are not to be used.
Sep 16, 2020, 7:29:39 AMto Neighborhood Watch, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, jcomerchero@rivco.org, C.Washington@rcbos.org
It sure would be nice if RIVCO would follow the example of the USDA/USFS Forest Closure and just close the park! Idyllwild does not want fire spread OR COVID spread! PLEASE respect our mountain community! Thanks 🙂
Sep 16, 2020, 7:40:14 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
It would really be NICE for people to work together on this , all I am reading is very negative to the park ranger he is trying everything he can to make it safe and yet we have people there being rude and not understanding that is not his call …. Sometimes people in Idyllwild want to cut off the whole town from everybody visiting and that isn’t the way Idlewild goes it is not for this chosen few there is for everybody to come visit if you don’t like it you should stay home in your house and make sure you don’t get the virus I live up the street and I don’t see your problem I see the problem of you being rude to everybody the man is trying to do whatever he can you can’t stop everybody from doing anything with the attitude that you guys have it’s kind of sad really after 35 years in Idyllwild I’m kind of disgusted at the shit that people are coming out of their mouth on this website you should think before you decide you want everything done for you !!!!!
Sep 16, 2020, 9:15:46 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, jcomerchero@rivco.org, C.Washington@rcbos.org, kylabrown@rivco.org
Anthony, Dayna, Dustin & Kyla-
The ongoing issue here is inadequate supervision of Idyllwild County Park. The more imminent issue is related to extreme fire risk, and RivCo Park’s lack of consistency with other land managers in the area.
Anthony, in our discussion last week, you described how campsites would be limited to ensure adequate spacing and address COVID-related distancing. In fact, there were very few empty campsites observed last Saturday night- perhaps 5-6 observable from the road (in a campground of 80+ sites)- and there was a high density of campers in close proximity to each other. Setting the question of COVID distancing aside, since the kiosk is only staffed during specific hours, any kind of walk-in campsite reservation that occurs when no-one is at the entry kiosk will choose any campsite that they wish, since no-one is regulating availability. This is an example of inadequate supervision.
Kyla, statements such as ‘RivCo Parks staffing levels are at full levels’ is a meaningless statement that does not address the issue: whatever RivCo Parks current staffing levels happen to be, they have been inadequate for a number of years. If the Park is going to choose to remain open during this time of extreme fire risk, then regular, consistent supervision should be taking place- not simply during ‘peak times’ at the entry kiosk. The new campground host is a welcome addition, however it is unrealistic to expect them to monitor 80+ campsites at all times.
There was clear evidence (observed Monday, September 14) of open fires in campsites 38 & 73- the fact that all fire pits had been diligently cleaned just prior to the weekend demonstrates this clearly:
More disturbing, there has been recent evidence of improvised fire rings completely outside of the fire pits- this evidence was found on August 24:
Inadequate Park supervision has certainly been a factor in these incidences.
My personal view is that the Park should be consistent with other land managers in the area, and close camping access to the Park until the risk of fire subsides. I do believe that hiking or day use in the area is reasonable- contrary to the National Forest and State Park, where hiking can involve backcountry camping, the hiking in Idyllwild County Park is day use only, and the public does need access to the recreational activities that the Park has to offer. This seems like a reasonable compromise between risk management and public access.
Since RivCo Parks seems quite resolved at this time to continue to allow camping, then improved supervision needs to take place. Better signage should be in place that reinforces the current fire restrictions-not just the single sign at the entry kiosk, but the same type of large signage placed in several locations along the campground road. (The much smaller, yellow placards are inadequate.) Steps to make fire pits or BBQ’s unusable (such as red taping, as Anthony has recently done) must be implemented. Of course, the RivCo Parks website should clearly state current fire restrictions.
It is a well documented fact that well over 90% of wildland fires are human-caused. After two major fires since 2013 that have resulted in a complete evacuation of Idyllwild, and current fire activity in California (and western states, in general) at historically extreme levels that has resulted in a complete shutdown of State and Federal lands, it should not be surprising that there is great concern amongst local residents of this community regarding the activities and policies of Idyllwild County Park.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Sep 16, 2020, 9:24:57 AMto Neighborhood Watch Notifications
HI Laura,
We are all neighbors and we are trying to work together nicely. We have long supported Anthony and we understand that he has a chain of command. We speak to Anthony in-person and we communicate with Kyla Brown, his boss. We are not attacking Anthony. Our concern is for the safety of the community. And you’re right. We will not agree on all issues. Closing the down the campsites in the park due to concerns about fire may not be important to everyone. Obviously, others are afraid of what could happen given that there are very few employees and camp hosts. The lack of staffing is not Anthony’s fault but it is a fact.
I do not recall seeing any personal attacks here. Nor do I recall seeing the use of profanity. Let’s not start that now. We’ve been exposed to too much of that on social media channels.
Again, we all support County Park and we are friendly with Anthony. But we have a right to express concerns about safety.
Thank you,
Dawn Papaila
Sep 19, 2020, 7:49:01 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
(The following reply is from Kyla Brown, General Manager for RivCo Parks- this reply is dated 9/16/20)
***
Mr. Jacobs,
Thank you for sharing your concerns again. I assure you, we take public safety, including the risk of fire very seriously. I would like to assure you that we communicate with State Parks as well as regional partners when adjusting our operations. You noted in your email that we are not consistent with USFS or State Parks. Here are the current restrictions/uses:
Here are the steps we have taken to help communicate restrictions:
As you have pointed out, some people go out of their way to ignore restrictions. So far, while there have been a few instances of non-compliance (mostly people unaware or not realizing they cannot use wood-fires to cook their food), guests have responded quickly and are understanding of the restrictions.
I hope this demonstrates our commitment to keeping people safe while allowing use of the park for outdoor recreation. We appreciate residents and park visitors reporting any unsafe conditions and will continue to address them as they arise. Please feel free to communicate directly to me, Chief McLain, or Ranger Supervisor Miller should you have additional concerns.
Respectfully,
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER | PARKS DIRECTOR
www.RivCoParks.org | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events
Sep 21, 2020, 10:05:33 AMto kylabrown@rivco.org, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, Dustin McClain, Whitaker, Dayna, Anthony Miller, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Kyla-
Thank you for the reply. You may have learned of the wildland fire that occurred near Idyllwild along Highway 74 last Saturday afternoon- though it was gratefully quickly extinguished, it provides yet another direct example of the extreme fire risk that exists in these mountains, and the great concern local residents have around any kind of fire source.
Consistency with other local land managers
In spite of the aspects you have cited (related to fire policies), there are significant inconsistencies between RivCo Parks management of County Park, vs. the State Park and National Forest. Most dramatically, the National Forest is closed to all activities, including camping.All trails in the San Jacinto State Park are closed, and camping is only allowed with a reservation made at least 48 hours in advance. Signage at the entrance to San Jacinto State Park on Friday, September 18:
Idyllwild County Park, however, remains open to all activities, with no advance reservation required. All considered, Idyllwild County Parks policies easily hold the least conservative policies of the public land managers in Idyllwild.
Signage
This sign is now located at the entry kiosk to Idyllwild County Park:
It was relocated there about a week ago by Larry, the campground host. Prior to this it was in a less prominent location. The smaller yellow placards located at several other locations along the campground road reinforce this message far less effectively. This large white sign should be present in at least 1-2 other locations along the Park road.
Fire pit taping
This is a good, temporary solution that only occurred a few days ago after my discussion with Anthony on September 10. Given the persistence of many people to have fires no matter what the Park’s policies might be, and the fact that supervision is not consistent through the week, a better solution would be steel lids that completely cover the fire pit and make it unusable. This would be a far better use of RivCo Parks resources, as opposed to installing barbeques in the midst of a dry, grassy meadow. (See: https://pinecrestwatch.org/idy-county-park-meadow-bbqs/ ) As described below, in numerous locations the taping is already falling away or has been damaged by camp users.
Park Supervision
As has been repeatedly observed over the years, supervision of the Park is a persistent problem. Over the weekends since the USFS & State Parks announced their restrictions (September 8), weekend supervision in Idyllwild County Park occurred in the manner you described- ranger vehicles were observed driving through the campground around 10 pm on Friday night (9/18/20), and 8 pm on Saturday night (9/19/20)- the entry kiosk at this time was unattended. No open flame fire sources were observed on Friday night, however an open flame source (not sure of the type) was observed in campsite 81 on Saturday night. On Sunday (9/20/20), 2 pm, no signs of recent fire activity was observed in any of the fire pits, however the taping is starting to fall off of many of them.
While it has been good to see this level of supervision during the high use periods of the last two weekends, there should be high levels of supervision on all days of the week. Since all other public land camping options in the Idyllwild area are either closed or very limited, Idyllwild County Parks open door policy means it catches all of the overflow, at all days of the week (it’s easy to conclude this is part of RIvCo Parks strategy in their policies). Besides the need for better Park supervision during current high risk fire conditions, there have been numerous past incidences in the Park that would benefit from improved supervision. (Ex: https://pinecrestwatch.org/idy-county-park-trespassing-fire-risks/ )
Limitations on campsite usage
Of the 96 sites at Idyllwild County Park, on Saturday night (9/19/20), approximately 26 sites were observed to be empty- indeed, this works out to be about 25% of the total capacity of the Park. Past dialogues with RivCo Park management have pointed out this policy is related to enhancing social distancing for COVID purposes. If this is the case, then more effort needs to be invested in ensuring better spacing. Almost all of the observed empty sites were in sequential clusters, with occupied campsites also in clusters. In particular, campsites 68-72 and 84-96 were all filled, with very high concentrations of people. (The level of impact from loud people, music, laser projectors into the trees, etc. was extremely high- and these sites immediately border the Royal Pines trailer park, with full time residents. On Sunday afternoon, a significant amount of trash was observed throughout the campground, including food wrappers, balloons, water bottles, juice bags, dog waste bags, etc. This kind of impact to the campground environment and local residents is a longstanding problem, but outside of the scope of the fire risks that are currently most imminent.) An example of trash found near just below the restrooms, near campsite 43:
It is a clear, inarguable fact that 90%+ of all wildland fires occur due to human-related activities- all it takes is one person…one instance…of poor judgement or mal intent to create massive destruction of lives and property. This past weekend provided yet another example of this, along with the Cranston Fire (2018) and Mountain Fire (2013). RIvCo Park management needs to continue to step up their efforts to mitigate these risks through improved supervision of Idyllwild County Park, and reconsider the priority of public safety over recreation revenues.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Oct 2, 2020, 11:40:36 AMto kylabrown@rivco.org, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, Dustin McClain, Whitaker, Dayna, Anthony Miller, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Kyla-
As of today, San Jacinto State Park continues to maintain closure of all trails- no walk-in camping is allowed (24 hour registration is required). All 18 National Forests in the State remain closed to *all* activities, including camping of any kind. We have had at least one National Weather Service Red Flag fire warning in the last week, and Santa Ana season is upon us. On Saturday, September 19, there was a wildland fire related to human activity on Highway 74, just west of Mountain Center.
On Saturday, August 15, a resident who lives immediately adjacent to Idyllwild County Park observed a wedding couple and their photographers taking pictures along the dirt road on the NW side of the meadow in County Park- they were using some kind of smoke generating device. Here is the Facebook post describing this incident:
The recent El Dorado Fire has burned over 22,000 acres, destroyed 10 structures and 4 homes, resulted in the evacuation of hundreds, and most tragically, cost the life of a firefighter from Big Bear. The point of origin of this fire was El Dorado Ranch Park, during a celebration by Park users (the infamous ‘gender reveal pyrotechnic device’). The parallels and potential for a similar event here at Idyllwild County Park are quite noteworthy, don’t you think?
The entire western US and all of the state of California is currently in the midst of the most extreme fire behavior ever observed- yet RivCo Parks policies remain the least restrictive of all public land managers, and the longstanding issue of inadequate supervision also remains.
Can you provide a rationale as to why RivCo Parks believes their current policies are reasonable, even though they do conflict with other public land managers in many regards?
Whatever staffing levels RivCo Parks is currently maintaining, if their policies intend to provide continued access to the public during a period of extreme risk, then increased supervision…not status quo…is quite appropriate. Can you explain why these supervision levels do not appear to have changed substantially from the period prior to this extreme fire risk?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Oct 7, 2020, 9:10:43 AMto kylabrown@rivco.org, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, Dustin McClain, Whitaker, Dayna, Anthony Miller, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Kyla-
A reply to the questions I posed in my previous email from you or any other member of the RivCo Parks Executive Team would be appreciated.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Oct 7, 2020, 9:45:39 AMto Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch(Kyla Brown’s reply:)
Brown, Kyla wrote on 10/7/20 9:36 AM:
Mr. Jacobs,
I am aware of the August 15 incident which Supervising Ranger Miller encountered that day as well. He engaged with the offending party and also educated them about the restrictions which were posted in the park. The group apologized and left. The park has not had any similar incidents since then.
In your message below, you assert we remain the least restrictive agency, yet we have imposed more stringent bans for fires, including not allowing propane fire pits. Our entire team of staff and volunteers, most of whom live on the mountain, take the threat of fire seriously. As you have noted, the red flag conditions continue. We have initiated the hiring process for a ranger to assist with evening patrols and provide additional on-site coverage of the mountain parks. This will be a temporary position and the heightened fire season warrants the additional help.
We appreciate the community keeping their eyes on the park and reporting any activities that pose concerns so that we may address them if we have not done so already.
Respectfully,
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER | PARKS DIRECTOR
www.RivCoParks.org | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events
Oct 8, 2020, 9:50:49 AMto kylabrown@rivco.org, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Miller, Anthony, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Kyla-
It’s difficult to accept the assertion you have been making regarding Park policies, given the simple reality that since September 8, all 18 National Forests in California (including San Bernardino National Forest- San Jacinto Ranger District) do not allow any use of those lands for any reason (no camping, day use, road access, etc)…and San Jacinto State Park trails are completely closed to any use- camping is allowed (at their developed campgrounds) only with reservations of 48 hours or more in advance. By comparison, current policy at Idyllwild County Park allows use of all trails, camping and facilities, and no prior reservation is required. At best, the Park’s policy regarding fire sources only matches San Jacinto State Park, and isn’t relevant to San Bernardino National Forest, where no access or use is allowed at all. This has raised the question: why does RivCo Parks Executive Team believe that their full access policy is reasonable, when the two other land managers in the area have much more stringent limitations?
It’s good to hear that a new Ranger position is in the hiring process- since the ongoing issue at Idyllwild County Park has been one of gradually declining supervision levels. Many of the residents around the Park have lived there for as much as 30-40 years, and can attest to a gradual reduction in supervision. This position should be present throughout most of the year, and not simply a temporary position as you’ve described- as you know, Idyllwild County Park is popular, and use has increased in recent years. There have been many past issues and incidences associated with the Park that would benefit from increased supervision:
https://pinecrestwatch.org/idy-county-park-illegal-encampments/
https://pinecrestwatch.org/idy-county-park-trespassing-fire-risks/
As a practical matter, it would have been much more appropriate to have this new supervisory position functional on September 8 (when USFS announced closures, and Idyllwild County Park followed with their use policies). Further, it sounds like the new position is still in the hiring process- extreme fire risk is present right now- what can the Park do immediately to address the need for increased supervision until this new position becomes active? Since extreme fire risks are the ‘new normal’ in western wildlands, can it be assumed that this new position will be functioning earlier in the summer camping season in coming years?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Oct 9, 2020, 7:17:01 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
John , From my understanding Lake Hemet is still open and people can still camp there they can’t use their use so I don’t know what the problem is with you but if they’ve got everything under control at the park you need to back off a little bit there is no reason to go to this extreme of shutting everything down again it’s against scientific protocol I don’t know if you’ve been reading the same thing I did but shutting everybody down it’s not healthy for everybody and I think that everybody needs to back off a little bit on the county park ! This seems to me like a smear campaign to the county parks because you’re not getting your way every time I turn around there’s something on my email about you complaining about the county park every time I turn around maybe you need to back off a little bit and let them handle their own problems instead of creating more that you seem to be doing!
Laura Elliott
Sent from my iPhone
Oct 9, 2020, 8:23:25 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
WOW Laura! First of all, Lake Hemet is a private campground and can do pretty much whatever they want. The County Park is a taxpayer-funded government facility and should listen to the concerns of the local community taxpayers (Thanks John!) as Kyla clearly welcomes. I would hope that you would be aware that this is the worst time of the year for extreme fire danger in Idyllwild. We have not had rain in months. Our winter provided for significant vegetation growth. I would also hope that you are aware that California has the largest number of Covid cases in the nation, as well as the second largest number of new cases. If the County Board of Supervisors would have respected the Governor’s Stay At Home Order, the County Park would have been closed and we would not be in the situation that we are currently at. 1,000 people per day are dying in the U.S. from Coronavirus and our forests are burning at record rates. Scientific protocol actually does call for shut down in both of these cases. Let’s all work together to mitigate both of these risks 🙂
Oct 9, 2020, 8:44:42 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Wow too ! I think you’re giving into the fear too and you’re overreacting I lived up there for 35 years and I know the rest I own property there I don’t think you’re being respectful of what’s going on you can’t keep everything shut up people are losing their livelihoods people can go to the park and behave appropriately they should be able to be there it’s not up to you or anybody else to tell them what to do I’m sorry I think it’s really sad when everybody doesn’t realize that not everybody agrees with what you are trying to do and I think the county park there is doing what they want to do and need to do and they’re trying to do everything to keep it safe you guys are not stopping and letting them do it I think you need to back off a little bit personally!Laura
Oct 9, 2020, 8:46:34 AMto ‘Laura Swanson’ via PC-RCPR Neighborhood Watch Info
Laura-
As I’ve mentioned in these dialogues with Kyla & the County Park administration, my personal view is that the Park should remain open at this time, but that doing so should include better supervision and management decisions. Both the local community and visitors to Idyllwild need a place to get outside &/or camp- since the National Forests and State Parks have been closed, this hasn’t provided any alternative, and I think County Park provides a reasonable option, if managed appropriately.
Supervision at the Park has been gradually declining for many years- those who regularly walk through the Park have observed this decline, and there has been a pattern of odd incidences in the Park that would likely be mitigated with better supervision. This issue goes hand in hand with the extreme fire risks that exist throughout the western US, and our local mountains, since literally ~95% of wildland fires have human causes. I’ve personally observed numerous examples of downright stupid behaviors in the Park (including an incident of visitors spinning a burning baton in campsite 1, immediately adjacent to the dry meadow)- the incident cited in August related to the wedding photography smoke device is only the most recent event. The placement of open BBQ’s amidst a field of dry grasses is another example of questionable management.
As far as fire risks are concerned, I believe that there should be zero tolerance for any inappropriate behaviors- as we all know too well from the string of recent wildfire activity, all it takes is a single moment of poor judgement or mal intent, and our homes, lives and beautiful mountains are lost. The primary issue here is mitigation of fire hazards, which requires good supervision and management decisions- both of which have a problematic history at Idyllwild County Park.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Brown, Kyla wrote on 10/9/20 11:27 AM:
John,
I appreciate your concern for the Idyllwild community and residents during this time of increased fire danger. Please be assured that our team works diligently to provide a safe environment to recreate in while minimizing risks. Here is an update on camping, trail and fire restrictions for this week:
SBNF:
Mount San Jacinto State Park:
Riverside County Mountain Parks:
You are correct that our reservation policies differ from state parks. We allow reservations to occur up to the same day, including walk-in reservations if we have adequate space. This policy is based on our real-time reservation system which is available to our on-site staff and volunteers. Staff and volunteers have the ability to accept payments and process reservations to accommodate those seeking place to stay overnight. This is true for all of our parks, including Idyllwild.
As for staffing levels, when resources are available we may add staffing depending on the need of the park/site. As you may be aware, our Park District went through a significant staffing reduction at the start of the pandemic (April/May) as a result of the immediate loss of programming and service revenues which comprise 40% of our overall budget. While it would have been ideal to have an extra supervisor position in place at the time the fire restrictions went in place, we simply were not in a position to make that happen. At this point in time, we are fortunate to be able to add a temporary position to the mountain parks team. That said, we must follow County hiring procedures. This can take time, but we are doing everything within our power to expedite the process. We will continue to evaluate our financial status along with our staffing needs and make adjustments as we are able to.
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER | PARKS DIRECTOR
Oct 11, 2020, 8:02:02 PMto Brown, Kyla, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Miller, Anthony, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Kyla-
Likewise, I appreciate your willingness to continue to dialogue on a very important issue that concerns many of the residents adjacent to Idyllwild County Park.
I’ve been monitoring the status of the September 8 National Forest closures, including the extension orders that have occurred since that time- the relaxation of some of those restrictions announced on Friday were somewhat expected. Since very little has changed in the risk factors for wildland fire (fuels moisture, overall fire activity state wide, etc.), I still question the wisdom of relaxing those closures, but such Federal and State decisions are generally beyond where I’m willing to invest my energies. In any case, these policy revisions have little relevance to RivCo Parks policies, as they have essentially maintained full accessibility to anyone since September 8.
Since supervision of the Park is the ongoing, overarching issue, it would be logical to expect that supervision levels will be stepped up as soon as possible, and into the future. It goes without saying that the sooner the temporary ranger position is filled and active, the better. More importantly, this additional supervisory position needs to be present throughout the year, especially during the high use/high risk times of the year- May through October. Will this be the case for 2021 and beyond?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Oct 11, 2020, 8:14:49 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
The county parks continues with more of their excuses and not any real action, a couple of employees renting or living in a county building is a far cry from someone who owns a home and has a stake in this community. Im sorry John just gets the runaround. Thanks for what your doing John.
—————————————–
Oct 22, 2020, 3:44:09 PMto Brown, Kyla, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Miller, Anthony, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Kyla-
Can you update on the status of the temporary Ranger position at Idyllwild County Park you described in your October 9 email?
Will this become a position that is budgeted into the coming year, to avoid lapses of supervision of the Park during seasons with higher fire risk?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Brown, Kyla wrote on 10/22/20 3:56 PM:
Mr. Jacobs,
The temporary Ranger position is still in recruitment. I do not have an ETA on when they will start but obtain updates every week.
This is not a permanently budgeted position and I cannot guarantee the position in future years. Adding the position will be dependent upon the resources available in the new fiscal year.
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER/PARKS DIRECTOR
Oct 23, 2020, 8:06:59 AMto Brown, Kyla, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Miller, Anthony, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Kyla-
It appears quite possible that the recruitment process will continue while the San Jacinto Mountains are at their highest risk during the Santa Ana season, and the hiring of the much needed temporary ranger position will occur after the rains have started, thus quickly ending the need for that position. That’s particularly poor timing.
Will RivCo Parks be actively attempting to find permanent budgeting for this much needed temporary position for 2021 (and beyond)? It would obviously be logical to immediately include this position in whatever budget projections are created for 2021, to ensure this position is functioning by the time the high risk fire season begins (~May).
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
10/26/20
Mr. Jacobs,
I agree with your sentiment about the desire for the extra position. Unfortunately, I cannot guarantee that we will be in the position to add the position permanently. This year posed a particular challenge with the funding losses as a result of the pandemic. We recovered enough to add the temporary position for this year and are hopeful we’ll have someone on board quickly. Each year, we evaluate our financial position and will request any positions necessary. Since we don’t receive County funding, the ability to fill positions is directly based on our financial outlook for the year. I anticipate next year will continue to be challenging as we recover from the pandemic and work to reopen many of our facilities that have been closed.
Respectfully,
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER/PARKS DIRECTOR
Nov 2, 2020, 1:10:20 PMto Miller, Anthony, Brown, Kyla, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Anthony-
This evidence of campfire activity outside of the campground area was found yesterday:
This is located above the Hillside Trail (above the Group Sites area), near the rock with the ‘hourglass’ shaped graffiti painted on it. It appears that this site was created a few months ago, and had been mitigated by someone, turning over the soil, and pushing the fire scarred rocks aside. There is significant combustible shrub and treecover in the area.
Anthony, do you know anything more about this site- when/if it was found by Park staff, and when it was mitigated? This is yet another example of campfire evidence that has been found outside the campground, and should be particularly worrying to anyone.
Once again, supervision could play an important role in spotting this kind of activity and stopping it immediately. Kyla, what is the current status of the temporary position at the Park? It is frustrating to hear that during such high risk fire conditions, that the Park system is willing to remain open to normal use during such unusual conditions, but that there is no apparent plan to balance this policy with longterm increased supervision.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Nov 5, 2020, 12:52:10 PMto John Jacobs, Brown, Kyla, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Hi John,
On September 12, 2020 around 12PM Park staff were patrolling in the park and saw smoke from an illegal campfire coming from the Hillside Trail. They hiked up and found two individuals at the site. Staff explained the fire restriction (and advised them of the danger they were creating with their illegal campfire). Staff immediately applied water and turned over the soil to be sure the fire was dead out. Staff further explained camping was not permitted where they were setting up, and took down their identification to take the further step of banning them from all Rivcoparks facilities. They were escorted from the property and the site was inspected again and cleaned further..
| Anthony MillerPark Ranger Supervisor RivCoParks (Riverside County Regional Park and Open-Space District) 4600 Crestmore Road, Jurupa Valley, CA 92509anmi…@rivco.org | (951)-529-5620www.RivCoParks.org #RivCoParks | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events | ||
11/5/20
John,
Regarding the status of the Ranger recruitment – unfortunately the first two people we were in the hiring process with ended up declining the position which is why it has taken so long. We were able to reopen the recruitment this week and will still work toward filling it as our need still exists. Feel free to share the job opportunity with those you think might be interested. The position recruitment closes next Wednesday and information can be found here: https://www.governmentjobs.com/careers/riverside.
Respectfully,
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER | PARKS DIRECTOR
Nov 6, 2020, 9:09:15 AMto Neighborhood Watch Notifications, John Jacobs, Brown, Kyla, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Riverside County Park Supervisors, Administrators, Rangers and Neighbors:
As a homeowner on Riverside County Park Playground Road, I’m deeply appreciative that we are keeping a record of safety concerns including illegal fire activity in the park. It seems that a solid case is being made to achieve the following objectives:
– Increased levels of paid and fully trained staff of the Riverside County Parks within the San Jacinto Mountains- Alignment of fire bans and associated policies across the National, State and County campgrounds within the San Jacinto Mountains
The objectives are crucial to protecting the safety of the entire town of Idyllwild, Pine Cove, Mountain Center and the surrounding mountain communities. Southern California Edison and Southern California newspapers have reported that this area has similar risks to those of Paradise, CA. Riverside County must take all necessary precautions to avert a similar tragedy.
John Jacobs acts as the primary spokesperson for our neighborhood watch group but this discussion is expanding to include a number of people within the Idyllwild area who share our concerns.
I understand that these parks are tax funded and that you also require fee revenue to run these parks. It is a business. I also note that, over the years, you have expanded the number of year-round camping sites at Idyllwild County Park. And you appear to be collecting a higher volume of fees at that park and at the Nature Center. I am hopeful that this increased revenue will translate to increased staffing year-round since we no longer have a “fire season.”
Thank you,
Dawn Papaila
Nov 6, 2020, 11:35:07 AMto Neighborhood Watch Notifications, John Jacobs, Brown, Kyla, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle
Pics from today evidence a camp fire at 83. Several tent campers tonight with freezing temps predicted. Not a Ranger, employee or host around.
Nov 28, 2020, 10:55:28 AMto Brown, Kyla, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
The illegal campfire near the Hillside Trail above the Group Sites area occurred on September 12, 4 days after the extreme fire risks at that time resulted in closure of all National Forests in California, and significant restrictions in use of State Park campgrounds (as has been thoroughly discussed, Idyllwild County Park restrictions remained the least conservative of all land managers in this area). Whatever policy changes that occurred at Idyllwild County Park during that time did not accompany any significant change in supervision of the Park.
The fact that this incident did not escalate into a disaster is quite fortunate for all of us. However, wildfires are well-known to explode into massive destruction within incredibly short periods of time- given the conditions that were present at the time, this easily could have done the same. However the Rangers might have found this campfire on September 12, it should not be interpreted as a sign that the current levels of supervision at County Park is satisfactory- there have been numerous other examples of illegal fires that have been reported to the Park and (recorded at the Pine Crest Watch website)- many of these were reported to County Park staff by other users or nearby residents.
It seems quite logical that when wildfire risks are at their height, if RivCo Parks management chooses to keep Idyllwild County Park open, there should be increased supervision levels present to monitor for dangerous activities.
Kyla, what is the status of the temporary ranger position hiring you described in October?
The recent cooler temperatures have been a welcome change, however there have been several Red Flag warnings from the National Weather Service over the last two months- the most recent warning was over Thanksgiving. NOAA has forecasted lower than average precipitation levels and higher than average temperatures for this coming winter- all of the Southwest US is under high risk fire conditions throughout the year. When will RivCo Park’s budgeting for increased supervision come to grips with this new normal?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Dawn Papaila wrote on 11/6/20 11:34 AM:
Nov 30, 2020, 4:47:03 PMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
John, you & your <neighbors> continue to do a great job protecting the Lower PInecrest area. Barry
11/3/20
Mr. Jacobs,
Thank you for reaching out again to share your concerns. As Park Ranger Supervisor Miller noted in his email about the illegal fire that occurred on September 12, the incident was caught be staff and addressed immediately with the added step of banning the offending parties from the park for future use. Your comment that RivCoParks is the least restrictive is inaccurate. As I have pointed out in the past, we have been the most restrictive.
As for the status of the temporary ranger at Idyllwild, we are still in the hiring process. Unfortunately, the first person we offered the position to ended up declining and we had to restart the process. In the meantime, we are ensuring proper coverage with the staff that are available and will continue to work toward filling the position, utilizing the extra ranger for as long as is deemed necessary. I appreciate your continued diligence in sharing concerns of the group and, as I mentioned before, we value the entire neighborhood keeping watch over the park to ensure it remains well maintained an safe.
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER | PARKS DIRECTOR
Dec 1, 2020, 8:52:45 AMto Brown, Kyla, McLain, Dustin, Whitaker, Dayna, Washington, Chuck, DeArmond, Michelle, Pine Crest Neighborhood Watch
Kyla-
The fact seems pretty clear that RivCo’s policies regarding Park access in response to the extreme fire conditions on September 8 were in fact, overall the least restrictive of the major land managers in the Idyllwild area (San Bernardino National Forest, San Jacinto State Park, Idyllwild County Park). While RivCo Park’s fire management policies were the same as the other land managers, that was a moot point in the National Forest, which was closed to all activities, including camping of any kind. San Jacinto State Park did not allow any camping for anyone without a reservation at least 48 hours in advance. During this time, Idyllwild County Park remained open (with fire restrictions) to any kind of use, including walk-in camping. Because of the restrictions the other land managers had imposed, Idyllwild County Park became the place where all overflow camping occurred. It’s difficult to understand how these clear facts aren’t self-evident, but perhaps we’ll have to agree to strongly disagree.
Looking forward, it’s unfortunate that the budgeting and planning process with RivCo Parks management hasn’t foreseen the need for improved supervision much earlier, and ensured that this additional ranger position was in place at the time it is needed most. This needs immediate attention to ensure that this lapse doesn’t happen in the coming months- what steps are being taken at this time to ensure adequate budgeting, and when will the hiring process begin to fill the temporary position in the coming year? Assuming this budgeting is put in place, what timeframe would the temporary position be in place?
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Mr. Jacobs,
Thank you for reaching out again to share your concerns. As Park Ranger Supervisor Miller noted in his email about the illegal fire that occurred on September 12, the incident was caught be staff and addressed immediately with the added step of banning the offending parties from the park for future use. Your comment that RivCoParks is the least restrictive is inaccurate. As I have pointed out in the past, we have been the most restrictive.
As for the status of the temporary ranger at Idyllwild, we are still in the hiring process. Unfortunately, the first person we offered the position to ended up declining and we had to restart the process. In the meantime, we are ensuring proper coverage with the staff that are available and will continue to work toward filling the position, utilizing the extra ranger for as long as is deemed necessary. I appreciate your continued diligence in sharing concerns of the group and, as I mentioned before, we value the entire neighborhood keeping watch over the park to ensure it remains well maintained an safe.
Kyla Brown, CPRE
GENERAL MANAGER | PARKS DIRECTOR
(951) 955-4398www.RivCoParks.org | Facebook | Twitter | Upcoming Events
This was caught on my Yard cam last night 8/26 at 1944 Hrs (7:44 pm).
Keep an eye out for this guy. Wearing a hat, possibly a bandana, Small pony tail, and gloves. Walking quite casual. There is no need for him to be on this odd path through my yard.
Maybe this was a lost Edison guy working late? Scouting for later? It doesn’t look like he made entry to the house.
Not quite sure what to make of it.Byron
This is concerning. It appears he came in from our yard. He is wearing gloves and one arm appears wrapped as if to be used to smash a window. It was nearly dark. A friend and I returned from a dog walk thru the park just a few minutes later. We didn’t see anyone On the road walking into the park or walking up to Pinecrest. Where did this guy go?
We have had several auto thefts and store break ins lately. I wonder if this should be shared with the Sheriff.
Dawn Papaila
Byron-
Looks at least questionable. And worthy of reporting to the Sheriff’s non-emergency phone number:
https://pinecrestwatch.org/resources/
They have repeated that *any* odd or unusual activity should be reported. One of the best ways to increase our much-needed law enforcement presence is by making them aware of incidences (no matter how seemingly minor). Circle back with whatever response you receive from them.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Wednesday morning, a broken glass beer bottle was found in my front yard. This is an unusual occurrence and I can’t remember seeing it before. Has anyone else had a similar problem recently? I’m curious if this is a widespread or localized occurrence.
Hal-
Yes, this has occurred at least twice in about the last year or so in front of my home, and my neighbor’s- the glass was all over the road. For many years, I’ve found small empty liquor bottles along the road, with tags on them from either Village Market or the Liquor store.
On a similar note, I’ve noticed an increase in general trash along the road, esp. at the intersection of Pine Crest and Riv Co Play Rd.
_________________________________
John Jacobs
Pine Crest – Riverside County Playground Rd. Neighborhood Watch
Idyllwild, California 92549
888-522-9001
www.pinecrestwatch.org
Aug 27, 2020, 9:16:45 AMto pc-rcpr-neighborhood-watch-info@googlegroups.com
Hal,
Several weeks ago I found a beer bottle in my driveway near the road. I didn’t see it until I ran it over.
I frequently find trash of this nature in my yard, particularly along the area with my white chain fence and near the pine trees on the road side.
Lots of liquor bottles and cigarette butts and other related refuse.
Tony
On February 14, 2019, over a 24 hour period, Idyllwild received over 7 inches of rain, creating extensive flooding and road damage. For nearly 48 hours following this rain event, the major highways to and from Idyllwild were effectively impassable. Here are some videos of the flooding of the creeks nearby our neighborhood:
In June of 2017, there were several illegal encampments created by apparent homeless persons in the wooded areas around Idyllwild County Park. These encampments included improvised structures of natural materials, and large amounts of items strewn around the ground in and around them. A wide variety of items included cooking implements, magazines, clothing, tampons, signs of intravenous drug use, candles, and many other random items. Of particular concern was the evidence of small fires that had been created in some of these areas.
Park personnel obtained a clean up estimate for at least one of the encampments- because of the presence of needles, this deemed the cleanup to be a hazardous materials remediation, with a cost estimate of nearly $9,000. Some of the other less hazardous sites were removed by Park personnel.
Here are some photos of these encampments:
Idy-County-Park-Illegal-Encampments